〜ならともかく
nara tomokaku
By Nihongo PathUpdated
Meaning
if it were X, that would be fine, but …; X aside, …
〜ならともかく sets aside an acceptable case (X) and criticizes or questions the actual one. 学生ならともかく、社会人がこんな服装では困る = "For a student, fine, but a working adult cannot dress like this". ともかく means "never mind, setting aside". It is close to ならまだしも but a bit more neutral.
Both spoken and written, in complaints, evaluations, and arguments. X is the case where the behaviour would be acceptable; the second half names the real, unacceptable case. Endings: 〜のは困る / 〜べきではない / 〜のは無理だ.
Formation
V = verb, N = noun, A = adjective.
N + ならともかく普通形 + の + ならともかく (知らなかったのならともかく)いA / なA + ならともかく (安いならともかく)Second half: the actual case + a negative judgment
Visual diagram
| Aspect | nuance | tone | example |
|---|---|---|---|
| ならともかく | X aside, the actual case is a problem | neutral, logical | 学生ならともかく、社会人がこの服装では困る |
| ならまだしも | X would still have been bearable, but this is worse | emotional, exasperated | 一度ならまだしも、三度も同じ失敗とは |
Natural examples
学生ならともかく、社会人がこんな服装では困る。
がくせいならともかく、しゃかいじんがこんなふくそうではこまる。
If you were a student, fine, but a working adult should not dress like this.
A student could dress like that; a working adult cannot.
一日二日ならともかく、一週間も休むのは無理だ。
いちにちふつかならともかく、いっしゅうかんもやすむのはむりだ。
A day or two would be fine, but taking a whole week off is impossible.
A day or two off is fine; a week is impossible.
知らなかったのならともかく、知っていて黙っていたのは問題だ。
しらなかったのならともかく、しっていてだまっていたのはもんだいだ。
If you had not known, fine, but knowing and keeping quiet is a problem.
Not knowing would be fine; knowing and staying silent is a problem.
近所ならともかく、遠くの店まで歩いて行くのは大変だ。
きんじょならともかく、とおくのみせまであるいていくのはたいへんだ。
A nearby shop would be one thing, but walking to a distant one is hard.
Noun + ならともかく.
無料ならともかく、有料でこのサービスの質はひどい。
むりょうならともかく、ゆうりょうでこのサービスのしつはひどい。
If it were free, fine, but for a paid service this quality is terrible.
The judgment ends the sentence.
Similar grammar and the difference
Nearly the same; まだしも stresses that X would have been "still bearable" and is more emotional. ともかく is more neutral: "X aside". Compare side by side
"Never mind X" to move to another topic (味はともかく、値段が高い). Not a scale of acceptable vs unacceptable. Compare side by side
"I don't know about X, but": sets aside an unknown or extreme case (昔ならいざしらず). ならともかく sets aside a clearly acceptable case. Compare side by side
Common mistakes
- ✗
- 社会人ならともかく、学生がこの服装では困る。
- ✓
- 学生ならともかく、社会人がこの服装では困る。
- Why
- X must be the acceptable case. The real, problematic case comes second.
- ✗
- 安いならともかく、高くてもいい。
- ✓
- 安いならともかく、この値段では買えない。
- Why
- The second half must contain a negative judgment about the actual case.
- ✗
- 知らなかったならともかく (careful writing)
- ✓
- 知らなかったのならともかく
- Why
- Verbs take の before ならともかく in careful Japanese.
The second half often has が / は marking the actual case: 社会人が / 一週間も. ならともかく can also concede a point in argument: 一回ならともかく、毎回では困ります. Compared with ならまだしも, it is safer in polite or business contexts because it is less emotional.
JLPT N1 tips
On the exam
- In 文法形式の判断, an acceptable case + a blank + a problematic case with a negative judgment is ならともかく (or ならまだしも). Choose ともかく when the tone is neutral.
- Distractor はともかく: it changes the topic and is not followed by a negative judgment on a parallel case.
- In 並べ替え, ならともかく is one chunk after X; the problematic case with が follows.
Frequently asked questions
What does 〜ならともかく mean?
if it were X, that would be fine, but …; X aside, …. 〜ならともかく sets aside an acceptable case (X) and criticizes or questions the actual one. 学生ならともかく、社会人がこんな服装では困る = "For a student, fine, but a working adult cannot dress like this". ともかく means "never mind, setting aside". It is close to ならまだしも but a bit more neutral.
How do you form 〜ならともかく?
N + ならともかく / 普通形 + の + ならともかく (知らなかったのならともかく) / いA / なA + ならともかく (安いならともかく) / Second half: the actual case + a negative judgment. V = verb, N = noun, A = adjective.
When is 〜ならともかく used?
Both spoken and written, in complaints, evaluations, and arguments. X is the case where the behaviour would be acceptable; the second half names the real, unacceptable case. Endings: 〜のは困る / 〜べきではない / 〜のは無理だ.
What is the difference between 〜ならともかく and 〜ならまだしも?
Nearly the same; まだしも stresses that X would have been "still bearable" and is more emotional. ともかく is more neutral: "X aside".
What is the difference between 〜ならともかく and 〜はともかく(として)?
"Never mind X" to move to another topic (味はともかく、値段が高い). Not a scale of acceptable vs unacceptable.
What is a common mistake with 〜ならともかく?
Wrong: 社会人ならともかく、学生がこの服装では困る。 Right: 学生ならともかく、社会人がこの服装では困る。 X must be the acceptable case. The real, problematic case comes second.
Quick check
子供（ ）、大人がそんなことで泣くなんて。